WoL vs. Math

[Spell]

Yeah, Spell, I think you're right that a tournament is not a one-size-fits-all solution. I love the idea of semi-regular training nights. As I noted in my previous post, it's something that one of the anons asked for over on the poll thingy. I think it's a great idea.

I keep coming back around to the idea that it would be helpful to have someone dedicated to taking charge of all of these ideas. With someone dedicated to leading this, it could ease the strain on the current coordinators, and people who already have been putting in a ton of effort on the duels.

To be clear, I don't think creating some events for new people should come at the expense of the current and veteran players. That's sort of why my ideas don't go to easing or changing the rules. So you're right, Spell, that this does not solve the instant gratification issue. But my theory, that has yet to be tested admittedly, is that if we create some institutional stuff for newer people, we might be able to better welcome and assimilate people who come check us out.

Then training nights is probably a better idea over a tournament if we're looking for a constant-thing, and that's not to say a tournament is a bad idea! They can still happen. If anyone wants to run a tournament, just run a tournament and see where it goes. I know in DoM you can probably ask a coordinator and they will see about giving you some elemental gems to use as prizes. As for DoF and DoS, i'm not to sure -- but reaching out has never hurt anyone and the staff is here to help.

As for a figurehead? I'm not so sure. I, personally, wouldn't feel obligated to talk to a middle man if I were to make something for new players, or for the playerbase as a whole. I'd rather just talk to a coordinator once I have a fleshed out idea and see where to go from there.

Also to anyone who may be shy about their ideas and don't want to post them on the board. The contact us area under the community will send a direct message to a coordinator of your choice ( if you don't know who they are by name ), or the option of sending it to site admins. That way you can contact them privately about your concerns / ideas. The senior staff page also lists coordinator / admin names. So you can PM them from there as well.

[Sabine]

Hallo!

Wanted to jump in because THIS IS EXACTLY the idea I was tossing around with one of the Coordinators. And then a little more.

So, here is my idea.

I would like to create a New Duelist Boot Camp of sorts.

This would include but not be limited to:

-1X1 time with myself and hopefully a co-Captain of this idea. Or Captains.

-Practice nights in a private chat that is not logged (no risk of scouting!)

-Maybe even a private forum. (may need to go offsite? or FB group?)

-Help going over and learning the Matrix, how to track your own duels, rules clarification, how to use the tools such as the practice game, and the resolving tool, etc

-Coached matches or no loss matches during regulation

- Help Pairing up with another mentor IC

-Perhaps an incentive of some sort. Like 1 fancy or wipe of losses or no loss nights while in boot camp. (Pending commitment and approval of Dueling Coordinators)

Does anyone feel this would be beneficial? Would people participate? Do we have other people interested in sharing in this effort to coach?

Obviously this would require a lot of coordinator approvals but if there is an interest, I am willing to spearhead it.

[Claire Gallows]

-Coached matches or no loss matches during regulation

-Perhaps an incentive of some sort. Like 1 fancy or wipe of losses or no loss nights while in boot camp. (Pending commitment and approval of Dueling Coordinators)

Does anyone feel this would be beneficial? Would people participate? Do we have other people interested in sharing in this effort to coach?

Obviously this would require a lot of coordinator approvals but if there is an interest, I am willing to spearhead it.

I liked the rest of it. These two above though I would worry that people would try to take advantage of them. Also, we'd want to really define what "coached" means.

For regulation, what if someone is newer but not in the boot camp and their opponent is. How's it fair for one of them to get their loss wiped but not the other?

As far as a drive to push mentoring and both IC and OOC training and learning, I'm all about. I've actually got something IC in the works but it might have to wait until I come back from leave.

[Sabine]

-Coached matches or no loss matches during regulation

-Perhaps an incentive of some sort. Like 1 fancy or wipe of losses or no loss nights while in boot camp. (Pending commitment and approval of Dueling Coordinators)

Does anyone feel this would be beneficial? Would people participate? Do we have other people interested in sharing in this effort to coach?

Obviously this would require a lot of coordinator approvals but if there is an interest, I am willing to spearhead it.

I liked the rest of it. These two above though I would worry that people would try to take advantage of them. Also, we'd want to really define what "coached" means.

For regulation, what if someone is newer but not in the boot camp and their opponent is. How's it fair for one of them to get their loss wiped but not the other?

As far as a drive to push mentoring and both IC and OOC training and learning, I'm all about. I've actually got something IC in the works but it might have to wait until I come back from leave.

I may be using the wrong terms, but maybe something alone those lines? Again, I don't understand the mechanics well enough (I think) to decide what the best incentives might be that would be fair... but *something.*

I feel like we have people asking for an incentive program of some kind and so far it's been a lot of no or skipped over. In order to appease both sides, we have to figure out something to give newer persons.

I wouldn't want to give out the incentive willy nilly but to be who are commited to dueling, hence being enrolled in Boot Camp and it lasts for a certain period of time only.

I am open to any and all ideas for sure! We have so many experienced and knowledgeable players who I'm sure could help me flesh out this idea better. I did reach out to Rakeesh privately as well. But any ideas, I am open to hear them and pitch them!

[Spell]

Hallo!

Wanted to jump in because THIS IS EXACTLY the idea I was tossing around with one of the Coordinators. And then a little more.

So, here is my idea.

I would like to create a New Duelist Boot Camp of sorts.

This would include but not be limited to:

-1X1 time with myself and hopefully a co-Captain of this idea. Or Captains.

-Practice nights in a private chat that is not logged (no risk of scouting!)

-Maybe even a private forum. (may need to go offsite? or FB group?)

-Help going over and learning the Matrix, how to track your own duels, rules clarification, how to use the tools such as the practice game, and the resolving tool, etc

-Coached matches or no loss matches during regulation

- Help Pairing up with another mentor IC

-Perhaps an incentive of some sort. Like 1 fancy or wipe of losses or no loss nights while in boot camp. (Pending commitment and approval of Dueling Coordinators)

Does anyone feel this would be beneficial? Would people participate? Do we have other people interested in sharing in this effort to coach?

Obviously this would require a lot of coordinator approvals but if there is an interest, I am willing to spearhead it.

Much of this can be done without coordinator approval except for the no-loss matches.

And even then there's no-loss nights and events in place that give wins and no losses. Such as tournaments and no-loss nights.

You also have to ask yourself why are the current methods not being used more. Mentor and mentee match ups not being organic and instead paired?

I don't like the idea of a win/loss clause for only one player. Some might choose to ignore said new player if they feel that they have nothing to gain from it. Which is why a blanked "no wins or losses counted" practice night could be better. You'd also have to explain coaching, because if a new player is being coached to fight someone else; who is to say that the coach isn't going off scout information, etc, etc.

[JewellRavenlock]

I hope this doesn't sound like I'm not supportive of your idea, Sabine, because I really like it overall!

I'm concerned about people not wanting to commit to something like a boot camp.

Showing up for a regular, monthly, practice night if they want (or don't feel like it) might be more flexible?

But I like a lot of the parts of your plan too about mentoring, practicing in a room where people can't scout/log. I think it allows for more OOC support, which is super important.

[Claire Gallows]

I hope this doesn't sound like I'm not supportive of your idea, Sabine, because I really like it overall!

I'm concerned about people not wanting to commit to something like a boot camp.

Showing up for a regular, monthly, practice night if they want (or don't feel like it) might be more flexible?

But I like a lot of the parts of your plan too about mentoring, practicing in a room where people can't scout/log. I think it allows for more OOC support, which is super important.

I could easily see a bimonthly or monthly open practice night where basic concepts can be gone over. It would be a good time to show off all the tools that we have at our disposal as well as give people a basic foundation upon which to build, whether they choose to do so alone or with a mentor, etc. Could easily take volunteers from the vets to spread out teaching so that multiple viewpoints can be considered and such. "It takes a village" sort of mentality.

[Sabine]

I can understand the commitment being a concern.

My concern is this... and I hope this doesn't come off as snotty.

We have these new people, we've had, 2? Speak up so far and we're looking to make some changes. People have expressed concern on if there is enough interest to make changes and add incentives. Talk of catering to new people has come as a concern. Some people have mentioned Veteran players feeling crappy that they had to "do it the hard way" and now someone else gets an "Easy" way....

The idea stemmed from trying to make sure we are giving the benefits to people who really want to be here.

But that might not be the best way to look at it either. Some people may not know if they want to continue dueling.

1 night a month things might be the way to go.

Like I said, I'm flexible. It was just another option to throw out there since a lot of other ideas have gotten poopoo'd on or don't seem like enough.

Additionally... I want to make sure we are offering more than in in-game incentive. An additional fancy or loss won't mean anything if the basic game mechanics are not understood.

1x1 time with people like Stacey, Melanie, Apple made all the difference for me personally.

[Spell]

I went over the weekly idea with Kruger in private.

1. The idea is that it will be held on the first Monday of the month.
2. Since it's a fight night, all three sports will be in play.
3. I will be there to help him, so both regulation *AND* practice dueling can happen.
4. At the start of the duel it will need to be brought up to the caller that it's a practice match.
5. Players can choose to fight at a higher rank if they like. This way they can get a feel for fancies. They can list how they would like to fight to one another and then come to the DUEL to set up the match.
6. Obviously practice duels do not count toward wins or losses. So there's no fear of one or the other.
7. The match will not even be listed on the caller write up. It will be as if it didn't happen so no fear if it being added to standings.

I'd ask that the fight night be held on ROH. Think: SEB DoF nights. We'd post up the information a week or so in advance so players will know where they need to be, and sit a DUEL in the RDI room to direct them over to ROH if they forget.

Regulation will continue as regulation. They won't be a factor in this. But if a new player did want to try regulation, they can.

[Claire Gallows]

I went over the weekly idea with Kruger in private.

1. The idea is that it will be held on the first Monday of the month.
2. Since it's a fight night, all three sports will be in play.
3. I will be there to help him, so both regulation *AND* practice dueling can happen.
4. At the start of the duel it will need to be brought up to the caller that it's a practice match.
5. Players can choose to fight at a higher rank if they like. This way they can get a feel for fancies. They can list how they would like to fight to one another and then come to the DUEL to set up the match.
6. Obviously practice duels do not count toward wins or losses. So there's no fear of one or the other.
7. The match will not even be listed on the caller write up. It will be as if it didn't happen so no fear if it being added to standings.

I'd ask that the fight night be held on ROH. Think: SEB DoF nights. We'd post up the information a week or so in advance so players will know where they need to be, and sit a DUEL in the RDI room to direct them over to ROH if they forget.

Regulation will continue as regulation. They won't be a factor in this. But if a new player did want to try regulation, they can.

I'd reeeeeeeeeeeally rather not take away one of our few nights of exposure on the RDI side. Contrasted with the SEB DoF nights which brought us -over- to RDI (bigger community), that would take it away. But that's just me. Other than that, I like that idea but it doesn't address group session foundational learning that should be done more OOCly than ICly, nor does it take care of the fact that those dueling rooms are still logged.

[Spell]

I went over the weekly idea with Kruger in private.

1. The idea is that it will be held on the first Monday of the month.
2. Since it's a fight night, all three sports will be in play.
3. I will be there to help him, so both regulation *AND* practice dueling can happen.
4. At the start of the duel it will need to be brought up to the caller that it's a practice match.
5. Players can choose to fight at a higher rank if they like. This way they can get a feel for fancies. They can list how they would like to fight to one another and then come to the DUEL to set up the match.
6. Obviously practice duels do not count toward wins or losses. So there's no fear of one or the other.
7. The match will not even be listed on the caller write up. It will be as if it didn't happen so no fear if it being added to standings.

I'd ask that the fight night be held on ROH. Think: SEB DoF nights. We'd post up the information a week or so in advance so players will know where they need to be, and sit a DUEL in the RDI room to direct them over to ROH if they forget.

Regulation will continue as regulation. They won't be a factor in this. But if a new player did want to try regulation, they can.

I'd reeeeeeeeeeeally rather not take away one of our few nights of exposure on the RDI side. Contrasted with the SEB DoF nights which brought us -over- to RDI (bigger community), that would take it away. But that's just me. Other than that, I like that idea but it doesn't address group session foundational learning that should be done more OOCly than ICly, nor does it take care of the fact that those dueling rooms are still logged.

If scouting is an issue then making a new name to play on is an option.. Or, well, the easiest solution would be to open a private chat on AIM and duel. These are things anyone can do if they would like to practice. Outside of that, there's really not many options beside "play on an alt if you don't want to be scouted". But when I was new I didn't care so much about any of that silly upper rank stuff. I just wanted to practice and play. So my friends and I would practice duel in the lobby.

This idea is mostly to put a session in place for practice dueling. If there are Warlord, Emeralds, Mages, etc who want to come out to these nights and give players pointers? Then they can and that would be great. That is the community aspect in this.

But if none do come out to help? Then the option of practicing is still there.

As for not hosting it on ROH. It's NBD to me. I don't mind doing it on RDI.

[Sabine]

Could use GR. That has the option to make private rooms that are not logged. Or AIM for practice duels.

I just feel like if we totally flesh out the idea and have like a...

"This is what we can offer you" incentive package put together to present to new players, it'd be enticing.

So having some set in stone options would be cool.

[Spell]

Could use GR. That has the option to make private rooms that are not logged. Or AIM for practice duels.

I just feel like if we totally flesh out the idea and have like a...

"This is what we can offer you" incentive package put together to present to new players, it'd be enticing.

So having some set in stone options would be cool.

Sorry. I'm not going to use GR since it's an 18+ site. But if you would like to do that in private, that's fine. But attaching a DUEL name to it? I can't do that.

[Claire Gallows]

I don't think practice alone was the point of what they were looking for. But I might've been wrong. If someone wanted to just practice, they can play with the practice tool. Foundational mentoring is a whole different story, which is what I was referring to.

[Spell]

I don't think practice alone was the point of what they were looking for. But I might've been wrong. If someone wanted to just practice, they can play with the practice tool. Foundational mentoring is a whole different story, which is what I was referring to.

Could always do a Looking for Mentor thread. Some players would post up in mentor threads about looking for someone. The method just isn't used anymore. There's a lot of ways to pair up someone with a mentor, or to not even mentor them and share your experiences.

Queen, for example, is someone I dragged onto this website. They weren't really my mentee listed on the site but I helped them practice and learn the sport OOC. Now look at them. 2 time Diamond, all title holder, etc.

These are things vets can do by themselves with new players, or even with a group of them and it would not require any higher ups ( coords / admins / etc ) needing a say in it.