Glass vs Emerald: Something of a Study

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Seirichi
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Post by Seirichi »

Candy Hart wrote:Everyone loves numbers!

Since I'm still relatively new (as compared to some) it wasn't too hard to go through my fight logs to get the numbers. I have everything in a word document so I could prod the standings keeper when my numbers were off.

At emerald rank I have fought 118 duels against duelist at glass rank. I have won 74%, lost 25%, and tied 1% of the time.
Numbers make my head hurt.. but I sort of want to go back and check the logs to do some number crunching of my own.
Kalamere wrote:Everything he wrote.
Agreed.
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Post by Harris »

Kalamere wrote:Personally I think that anywhere from 70-90% would be ideal. It shouldn't be so bad that the Emerald just automatically wins the duel and there's no point even fighting it. I also don't think that it should be anywhere near a 50/50 proposition. If a Glass can win 1 in 4 times against an Emerald, I think that's fine. More than that and I think perhaps the mechanic isn't doing its job.

If there were no Glass duelists around and you were forced to suffer though taking on Emeralds, then maybe that discussion would have to change. As I showed in my first post in this thread however, that is far from being the case.

Being that (a) you personally see a 30%+ win rate vs. Emeralds and (b) Glass rank duelists make up the majority of the duelists fighting; I don't see a legitimate cause for change. The chasm is, in my view, no more wide than it ought to be.
All of this. EXACTLY.
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Post by MurOllavan »

Thread so big I'm missing responses.
Velhelmi Torvald wrote: Mur,
The folly of this argument is that the Emerald vs Emerald is not at nearly as severe a disadvantage because they have the option to Feint that Fancy Dodge. It neglects the pain I went through to break down the three powerhouse defensive moves, Fancy Arm Block/Dodge/Duck. It also neglects that you’re a healthy dose of Chop/Snap Kick/Spin Kick is still a bad investment of a move.
I wasn't trying to argue that EmeraldX2 was at the same level of disadvantage. I was arguing that its still an important decision point for the failed LS Emerald...and the disadvantage shown isn't enough to say the parity between glass - emerald is a worry.
Jump Kick – Leg Sweep 0-0

I’ll pick between Fancy Arm Block, Fancy Dodge, Fancy Duck, Jab and Leg Sweep only via use of a random number operator. You pick any move you want, any time you want, other than Sweep, from rank Glass. We’ll do this 100 times and see what the score is and if you can find a way to consistently beat five moves with .I’ll bet money you’re going to lose and lose by a lot by using “a healthy amount of Chop/Snapkick/Spinkick” because any amount in this situation is unhealthy because this is casino dueling.
Since you said random I'll use 1/5 probability of each move. I flip a coin between Legblock and Dodge. However if every time I get an ADV(which you call useless) you are forced to play an additional round to see if I score I think it would be closer to real dueling. If that were tacked on to your challenge I think I could come super close to break-even.

However the entire example misses the point, real dueling with humans isn't like that. One, a simple 1 round duel is not equivalent to 5. Two, the biggest advantage one can get is past history on your opponent. That's why I said CH/SnK/SpK should be used. Not because they are strong in a vacuum, but to force the Emerald to widen their range.
to use defense and, even if successful, will probably not have anything to show for it the following round, which I’ll break down again in the following post.
The psychology of having an ADV is important. I would call it 'soft control' of your opponent. You don't have to convert, but the threat of a conversion now needs to be taken into consideration by the Emerald.
On a side note, I disagree with you about your comment about Fancy Lateral Parry and would have fun arguing that on a separate thread. I’m really interested in this because I think you’re wrong but I want to see if you have an insight that’s I’ve missed.
I was simply comparing parrying after a cut (perhaps I should have used the mathematically better FSS??) to defense in fists after LS. I would call this trying to punk the lower rank. Meaning I FSS after a cut much more often against what I think is a newcomer versus a more experienced DoSer. If you check my AIM I'm always open to discussing dueling, though I'm not online often right now.

All in all I think Kal said it best. If you look at numbers glass succeed about 30-40% of the time. That's not a wide gap to me. If someone goes 5-9 against Emeralds as a glass I think they did good. If it was 2-10 by duelists that do well in the other sports, and this was constant (this type of stuff was old DoM) then I think there would be reason to worry.
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Post by Deluthan »

I want to argue the carryover ADV one more time as an improvement to the game (but not as a solution to Velhelmi’s problem), because I think the way ADVs work currently is so ingrained in everyone’s head that it’s making it difficult to see the bigger picture. So, here it goes:

First, some perspective: Stop thinking of the carryover ADV as a rule exception and realize that it is actually the norm in how a score would naturally be kept, and that these (what I will now call) single-round ADVs that are currently implemented are the exception. The single-round ADV is a vestige from a time in DoF when not a lot about the game made sense, when Fancies would give you an ADV in a miss-miss (yes, two Fancy defenses would give ADVs to both!), when Feints would actually split an opponent’s point into two ADVs, so that both players had an ADV. Remember that? Just so the newer folks know where I’m coming from (and not to toot my own horn), I was the driving force behind the last Feints change, and the current system is largely based on a proposal of mine, so I am very confident in my understanding of how DoF works as a game.

Now, let’s talk about basic theory in matrix-based game design. It reads like this: If you select a move that scores on your opponent, the score should be altered in your favor. That’s it. So, that you would lose your ADV when your opponent’s move misses makes no sense; it violates basic theory.

Imagine that DoF has never existed and that we are creating the game from scratch at this very moment. We’ve built the matrix, and we’ve decided that a player must score two consecutive ADVs in order to garner a point, otherwise the first ADV is lost. Keeping the ADV in the event that both you and your opponent miss would be the natural setup; you would actually have to argue the need to implement a single-round ADV. What reason for it would you, or could you, have to argue it?

Next, I want to discuss an example in order to look at how the carryover ADV works into strategy and how it can actually empower and expand strategies for the ADV-earner.

Example: Glass vs. Glass. Round 1, Dodge/Jab (0+-0).

With a single-round ADV, the pressure is on the ADV-earner to convert the ADV in the next round or lose it. The safe bet for the opponent is to go defense, because the opponent knows that (1) it will wipe out the ADV guaranteed and (2) he (or she) has a good chance at getting an ADV himself. Really, the only practical strategy for the ADV-earner is to give-up on the ADV and go offense to go after the opponent’s defense, or hedge bets and go defense in case the opponent is overthinking (or underthinking) the situation.

With a carryover ADV, the pressure falls on the opponent (as it should), because going defense isn’t going to do him any good if he is anticipating his opponent going defense. Instead, he is going to want to go Spinkick or some such defense buster. Going defense comes into play only if he is anticipating the ADV-earner reneging the ADV for the open offensive point, or as a stall tactic in order to reclaim the Jab. The ADV-earner must determine which way they want to defend, or if they instead want to sneak in an offensive shot. A great option for the ADV-earner here is a Jumpkick or Legsweep: Because the opponent does not have his Jab, the ADV earner has a great chance of landing a shot if the opponent tries a defense buster, and if the opponent goes Jumpkick or Legsweep (very likely moves), then the ADV-earner will still have the ADV for the next round.

It’s important to note here that the ADV-earner is empowered by the possible strategic options, while the opponent is the one on the fence. Under the single-round ADV system, ADVs are throwaways, and the ADV conversion becomes a novelty.

Now, to rebuke some concerns with the carryover ADV. I’m quoting Seirichi here, but my comments are directed at everyone with reservations.…
Fights will become more sluggish.
I call bogus here, because it’s actually the single-round ADV that encourages dead rounds, as explored in the above example. It encourages the opponent to go safe and drop back in defense. The carryover ADV encourages either side to go offense. In the playtest duels that have been posted here, the duels got drawn out because the opponent at the disadvantage was going defense after the ADV was earned. What was the thought process there? Did the opponent actually think the ADV-earner was going to renege on the ADV and go offense, was he/she still stuck in the single-round ADV mindset of wiping out the ADV with a null round, was it a stall tactic?

I suggest more playtesting, in a scenario where there is more up for grabs. I checked the list of duels in IFL duels with carryover ADVs, and in only three instances did the same ADV last more than 2 rounds (i.e. carried over more than once), and never more than 3. Two of those instances involved a Jumpkick/Legsweep exchange in the first carryover, and the other instance involved a failed Feint against an offensive move in the second carryover. What that tells me is the carryover ADV encourages a better mix of offense and defense, and less the defense/defense dead rounds.
Glass vs Glass, Glasses will possibly toss ADV Carry out the window and go straight offensive to get the job done.
If this is correct, then it is really no different than it is now. However, because the ADV will give a Glass more so-called strategic empowerment, Glasses will use defense just as much as they do now, and quite possibly more so*.
Emeralds will use more mods to combat the ADV Carry.
By this I think you mean more Feints, because Glasses will be working in more defense. Sure, but if an Emerald is using Feints, they are probably also using Fancies, i.e. mod-smacking their opponent into submission, which gets us back to the core of Velhelmi's initial post.

Our flaw is that we so quickly look to changing game rules when there is a problem. Making significant changes to game rules should be a last resort. It should be difficult for a Glass to beat an Emerald.

What is the problem? The problem is that DoF, as well as the other sports, do not have a healthy pool of new duelers. The true Glasses do not have other true Glasses to battle among and rise above. So, when a true Glass shows up to duel, all they have are Emeralds and sandbaggers from which to choose.

Solution? Get more newbies in here. That’s tough, so maybe the DoF staff needs to be more creative with finding ways to throw Glasses a lifeboat without rule changes or additional ranks (e.g. special events, special shifts). In the meantime, I am of the opinion that mod distribution should be reduced by 1, and that Emeralds should have only 5 mods, because, really, only titleholders should get excess mods**, and start Glasses with 1 mod. That might not help Velhemi's situation enough, so perhaps consider forced parity, only allowing duelers to use one or two more mods than their opponent, as it's well established that players aren't going to limit themselves (and, in all fairness, shouldn't have to). These are rule changes that can easily be reset down the road.

*OK, this could draw Glass-Glass duels out longer than Emerald-Emerald, but only for a lack of mods. You see the same thing happen in DoS with Commoner-Commoner duels, i.e. less options for scoring full points.

**By excess mods, I mean any mods over the maximum amount you would need to win a duel if you were successful in scoring on all of your modified moves. So, really, anything over 5, because a modified move scores 1, and you only need 5 to win.
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Post by Jake »

Deluthan wrote:...and that Emeralds should have only 5 mods, because, really, only titleholders should get excess mods**,
I want to note here that the decision not to give Opals an additional mod (over the 6 that Emeralds receive) was specifically to avoid people challenging just to get an extra mod, and to instead encourage challenging for/holding titles for RP reasons.
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Post by Seirichi »

Jake wrote:
Deluthan wrote:...and that Emeralds should have only 5 mods, because, really, only titleholders should get excess mods**,
I want to note here that the decision not to give Opals an additional mod (over the 6 that Emeralds receive) was specifically to avoid people challenging just to get an extra mod, and to instead encourage challenging for/holding titles for RP reasons.
:) It's the reason I challenged for IceDancer. I wanted King to do stuff like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dr367BlTYH0 and FireStar http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mw6boUBtQuQ. But I looooost!

The encouraging for RP reasons is nice. People will challenge either way, it's there - why not challenge for it? Taking away a mod from an Emerald and Adding it to only Opal won't make much of a difference probably. There's not many active Emeralds right now who are even attempting to challenge either way. As of now, there's only 12 ( 10 since both King and Seiri's are up for this month ) who are able to challenge, out of 36? I could be off a number or two.

In the end the loss of one mod isn't going to change the problem between Glass and Emeralds, which is the subject for this thread. New players *should* lose or practice in the current system to be able to overstep these six mods, or at least attempt to.

If a person wants to make rank. Put effort in it. If you want to duel for fun, duel for fun. Look what happened in Cataclysm in World of Warcraft. They made heroics too hard, newer players left. They dumbed them down, older players left. ( Well I think some left during Wrath of the Lich King too ) DoF isn't hard. It isn't easy. It's doable and doable should be changed? Rena is our newest Emerald I believe. People are still gaining rank with the current system.
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Post by Harris »

Deluthan wrote:Next, I want to discuss an example in order to look at how the carryover ADV works into strategy and how it can actually empower and expand strategies for the ADV-earner.

Example: Glass vs. Glass. Round 1, Dodge/Jab (0+-0).

With a single-round ADV, the pressure is on the ADV-earner to convert the ADV in the next round or lose it. The safe bet for the opponent is to go defense, because the opponent knows that (1) it will wipe out the ADV guaranteed and (2) he (or she) has a good chance at getting an ADV himself. Really, the only practical strategy for the ADV-earner is to give-up on the ADV and go offense to go after the opponent’s defense, or hedge bets and go defense in case the opponent is overthinking (or underthinking) the situation.
Disagree. The pressure in that scenario is squarely on the Glass that jabbed. The Glass at 0+ just A) Expanded their scoring options for the next round to every single move in the matrix, B) Beat their opponent's power move. The Glass that jabbed has to consider *every* possibility in that situation, offensively and defensively, giving the 0+ Glass a huge advantage. The fallacy in your argument is that you seem to think Glasses find defense to be particularly dangerous at the moment and use it with the same frequency Emeralds do. The fact is, in this round one scenario, the Glass that jabbed, even if their opponent converts in round two, can make up that ground in one round. What it took their opponent two rounds to do, they can do in round three and the score is tied.
Deluthan wrote:With a carryover ADV, the pressure falls on the opponent (as it should), because going defense isn’t going to do him any good if he is anticipating his opponent going defense. Instead, he is going to want to go Spinkick or some such defense buster. Going defense comes into play only if he is anticipating the ADV-earner reneging the ADV for the open offensive point, or as a stall tactic in order to reclaim the Jab. The ADV-earner must determine which way they want to defend, or if they instead want to sneak in an offensive shot. A great option for the ADV-earner here is a Jumpkick or Legsweep: Because the opponent does not have his Jab, the ADV earner has a great chance of landing a shot if the opponent tries a defense buster, and if the opponent goes Jumpkick or Legsweep (very likely moves), then the ADV-earner will still have the ADV for the next round.
I agree with this sentiment that the ability to stall with defense on defense goes out the window and forces the Glass without an advantage into a decision in regard to trying to wipe away that advantage and clean the slate. But who's even doing that now? This strikes me as a moot point. I don't see Glass duelists using defense to stall other Glasses because defense isn't currently dangerous, as I stated in my above point. Knowledgeable Glasses may use defenses for the sake of stalling upper ranks with fancies in key positions.
Deluthan wrote:It’s important to note here that the ADV-earner is empowered by the possible strategic options, while the opponent is the one on the fence. Under the single-round ADV system, ADVs are throwaways, and the ADV conversion becomes a novelty.
What you consider novelty I think falls into the category of strategy. The idea of the advantage conversion is what the current system relies on, not the actual conversion itself. It's about suddenly giving your opponent an additional worry. It's not so much the end state of converting it's the *potential* your opponent has to convert suddenly as their 1 point scoring options essentially increase by roughly a third.
Deluthan wrote:I’m quoting Seirichi here, but my comments are directed at everyone with reservations.…
Fights will become more sluggish.
I call bogus here, because it’s actually the single-round ADV that encourages dead rounds, as explored in the above example. It encourages the opponent to go safe and drop back in defense. The carryover ADV encourages either side to go offense. In the playtest duels that have been posted here, the duels got drawn out because the opponent at the disadvantage was going defense after the ADV was earned. What was the thought process there? Did the opponent actually think the ADV-earner was going to renege on the ADV and go offense, was he/she still stuck in the single-round ADV mindset of wiping out the ADV with a null round, was it a stall tactic?
Again, I have to disagree with you. You're assuming defense is being used at all currently at the lowest level. DoF is heavily an aggressively offensive sport at the Glass/Glass level. The fact that advantages yield nothing unless used successfully in consecutive rounds means that Glasses don't see them worthwhile when offense takes one round and yields an immediate result. There are *rare* dead defense rounds in the current system because lower ranks aren't using defenses. The only scenarios that come into play tend to be after a failed flip or in an effort to nullify upper ranked fancies. I think the carryover system makes the advantage more powerful and it would be used more frequently. I don't think sluggish is the right word, but I think the duels may slow down slightly based on the simple fact that defense would be used more frequently. DoF tends to be the fastest sport because of its offensive aggression. Lessening that lengthens duels. I can't predict by how much and in the end it might be marginal.
Deluthan wrote:In the meantime, I am of the opinion that mod distribution should be reduced by 1, and that Emeralds should have only 5 mods, because, really, only titleholders should get excess mods**
I've always thought DoF had too many mods. Any scenario where you can win a match with nothing but mods and *still* have mods leftover is overkill. I think this stems from the fact that DoF has *two* modifiers though. The feint and the fancy. And if memory serves me correctly (Jake or Matt will correct me) there used to be a legitimate split. X feints, X fancies. I don't know what the catalyst was for pooling all the mods, but I think that's why we have so many. I would not at all be against dropping mods by 1. Diamond - 6, Emerald - 5, Sapphire - 4, Ruby - 3, Jade - 2. My own experience is that to use six modifiers, you have to force it. I myself rarely use six and I honestly rarely see other people use all six.

Deluthan wrote:and start Glasses with 1 mod
This is already in play. It's called the mentoring system. Are you suggesting this *instead* of mentoring or in addition to? Because if it's in addition you're basically advocating starting people at Jade. We already have a freebie system in place that takes very little effort to use.
Deluthan wrote:That might not help Velhemi's situation enough, so perhaps consider forced parity, only allowing duelers to use one or two more mods than their opponent, as it's well established that players aren't going to limit themselves (and, in all fairness, shouldn't have to). These are rule changes that can easily be reset down the road.
No, absolutely not. Forced parity works in small doses, like leagues such as IFL. Even then, it's questionable to me. Nobody should be forced to duel down to anyone in a more permanent scenario, especially when making rank is involved. The option should always be there for anyone to fight however they want.

I think this idea has a heavier impact on the Glass rank and how they combat each other and Emeralds. The carryover advantage in my mind will change the nature of Glass/Glass encounters and lead to more defense utilized. On the flip side, I think we'll see Emeralds expanding their modifier usage to include feints, since they're less risky defense beaters. And one of the elements that has to be considered and weighed is the fact that since the IFL system had forced parity there aren't any 6 mod/0 mod examples to look at. In any case, I suppose it's a matter of the trad eoff being worthwhile. Having some true Glasses to test this out would be nice.
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Post by Jake »

Harris wrote:
Deluthan wrote:In the meantime, I am of the opinion that mod distribution should be reduced by 1, and that Emeralds should have only 5 mods, because, really, only titleholders should get excess mods**
I've always thought DoF had too many mods. Any scenario where you can win a match with nothing but mods and *still* have mods leftover is overkill. I think this stems from the fact that DoF has *two* modifiers though. The feint and the fancy. And if memory serves me correctly (Jake or Matt will correct me) there used to be a legitimate split. X feints, X fancies. I don't know what the catalyst was for pooling all the mods, but I think that's why we have so many. I would not at all be against dropping mods by 1. Diamond - 6, Emerald - 5, Sapphire - 4, Ruby - 3, Jade - 2. My own experience is that to use six modifiers, you have to force it. I myself rarely use six and I honestly rarely see other people use all six.
In fact, I had already linked to this once before in this discussion.

http://duelingzone.org/roh/dof/archive/ ... -03-01.TXT

Code: Select all

      Rank                    Number of Fancy Strikes/Feints
-------------------       --------------------------------------
White Belt                 0 Fancy Strikes/Feints
Orange Belt                1 Fancy Strike, 1 Feint
Green Belt                 2 Fancy Strikes, 2 Feints
Red Belt                   3 Fancy Strikes, 3 Feints
Black Belt                 4 Fancy Strikes, 4 Feints
Sensei                     5 Fancy Strikes, 5 Feints
Which gave top ranked duelers 10 mods to work with (5 of each type), which was then combined and reduced into the current numbers.
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Post by Kalamere »

Base numbers comparing the 2006 and 2007 IFL seasons in terms of duel length.

The 2007 season (w/ ADV carryover) saw 215 duels totaling 1,842 rounds.
Average rounds per duel: 8.57
Median rounds per duel: 8

Compared to the 2006 season which saw 147 duels totaling 1,222 rounds.
Average rounds per duel: 8.3129
Median rounds per duel: 8

So, the 2007 season saw slightly longer duels.. but only slightly and more in the outliers.

In fairness, this query should probably be restricted in some way to make sure at least one of the duelists involved was of the lower ranks and therefore apt to use this rule. I'll see what happens if I change the query to force at least 1 duelist in the fight to have 3 fancies or less.
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Post by Rakeesh »

I feel like anything that I would add to this conversation has already been broken down and analyzed by someone else. In short, I think that the original poster brings up valid points, but lacks an overall understanding of the nuances of the DoF matrix and its many options round-to-round. It's understandable, because there isn't necessarily a whole lot of inherent reason to understand the relationship of all moves at the Glass level. I do believe that there is a trade: Glass vs Emerald is a steep challenge, technically, but the system also is designed to give (IMO) by far the best end game matrix of any of the sports. I do think that your best option is to become a Jade yourself (and use this new mentoring system-thing) by picking your battles. Once you have fancies/feints, you will begin to improve more quickly with the matrix as a whole (again, IMO).

Onward.

I remember liking the ADV carry-over. It didn't affect overall strategy much and was a small improvement to what can be a frustrating part of the matrix (wasted ADVs). Then again, I also liked the rank-vs-rank fancy/feint cap that we had in TDL and IFL.

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Post by Kalamere »

Ran more queries, restricting the rank of 1 of the 2 duelists in the fight to see where that took us:

When 1 Duelist has 3 fancies or less
--------------------------------
2007 = 186 duels, 1,610 rounds or 8.6559 rounds per duel
2006 = 130 duels, 1,080 rounds or 8.3077 rounds per duel

When 1 Duelist has 2 fancies or less
---------------------------------
2007 = 150 duels, 1,280 rounds or 8.5333 rounds per duel
2006 = 86 duels, 728 rounds or 8.4651 rounds per duel

When 1 Duelist has 0 fancies
-----------------------------------
2007 = 20 duels, 170 rounds or 8.5 rounds per duel
2006 = 41 duels, 356 rounds or 8.68 rounds per duel

Overall, I'd say that there is nothing here that shows the 2007 IFL ADV rule extended duel length a meaningful amount.
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Post by Harris »

Kalamere wrote:Ran more queries, restricting the rank of 1 of the 2 duelists in the fight to see where that took us:

When 1 Duelist has 3 fancies or less
--------------------------------
2007 = 186 duels, 1,610 rounds or 8.6559 rounds per duel
2006 = 130 duels, 1,080 rounds or 8.3077 rounds per duel

When 1 Duelist has 2 fancies or less
---------------------------------
2007 = 150 duels, 1,280 rounds or 8.5333 rounds per duel
2006 = 86 duels, 728 rounds or 8.4651 rounds per duel

When 1 Duelist has 0 fancies
-----------------------------------
2007 = 20 duels, 170 rounds or 8.5 rounds per duel
2006 = 41 duels, 356 rounds or 8.68 rounds per duel

Overall, I'd say that there is nothing here that shows the 2007 IFL ADV rule extended duel length a meaningful amount.
I will happily concede this point in the face of numbers. I would say I still have a concern with data IFL doesn't and can't give us. And that is specifically how a 6 mod duelist interacts with a 0 mod duelist with the carryover system. As IFL forced parity, there are no examples of this to draw from. In the same way I'm not for lessening the chasm between Emerald and Glass I'm also not for implementing a system that may possibly *widen* that chasm further. That to me is the most salient question. Emerald/Emerald is virtually unaffected. Glass/Glass may see an improvement and expansion of defense use. What about Emerald/Glass though, which was the original subject of this thread?

Does implementing the carryover system by itself (i.e. not with forced parity like in IFL) widen the gap between Emerald and Glass? That's the biggest potential negative here that may only be solved by playtesting with true Glasses.
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Post by Charles Blackstone »

Well. I can not say I have read all of the way through all of the post. But a good friend of mine told me to post after the events of 12/18/12 DOF on ROH

Matt vs Charles 12/18/12 AKA:
Emerald vs glass

DUEL Candy: Bleed! 1: Old Man is denied. (AB/SN) + Chuck
DUEL Candy: Bleed! 2: Leap frog? (DU/LE) 0-0 all
DUEL Candy: Bleed! 3: Hug it out boys. (FLx2) 0-0
DUEL Candy: Bleed! 4: Only took four rounds. Someone's on the board. Old Man. (DO/SW) 1-0 Matt
DUEL Candy: Bleed! 5: Tied up. (FL/CH) 1-1 all
DUEL Candy: Bleed! 6: Chuck gets out fo the way. (DU/JB) 1+-1 Chuck
DUEL Candy: Bleed! 7: The old man can't keep up to the one young at heart. (SW/FaDU) 2-1 Chuck
DUEL Candy: Bleed! 8: It's a trade. (JBx2) 3-2 Chuck
DUEL Candy: Bleed! 9: Chuck lands on top of the old man. (JK/SN) 4-2 Chuck
DUEL Candy: Bleed! 10: Matt must have knocked something loose. He's going the wrong way right into a painful end. (JB/FaLE) 5-2 Chuck

((On a side note, i am one of the few pure glass out there, not a smurf account or anything.))

As you can see, i beat an emerald (nothing against matt, the guy is down right awesome at dueling). No fancies, no assists. I had one set of notes from when he 5-1'd me a month ago. And I went on that, keeping what my mentor candy told me in mind.

So i guess the solution is, Help the Glass learn. But dont give away fancies and things. It would help, it will only hurt.

(Added after that duel)
Just a quick note, i went on to duel myria Graziano and lost 5-2. So again it can sway either way. But its upon the player to do well, not upon the system to help them do well.
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G
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Post by G »

Charles Blackstone wrote: Just a quick note, i went on to duel myria Graziano and lost 5-2. So again it can sway either way. But its upon the player to do well, not upon the system to help them do well.
This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This.

Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes.

In case there's any questions, I AGREE WITH THE ABOVE.
G'nort Dragoon-Talanador
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Seirichi
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Post by Seirichi »

G wrote:
Charles Blackstone wrote: Just a quick note, i went on to duel myria Graziano and lost 5-2. So again it can sway either way. But its upon the player to do well, not upon the system to help them do well.
This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This, This.

Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes.

In case there's any questions, I AGREE WITH THE ABOVE.
Ditto.
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