Hydra Cup OOC Rules

[Kalamere]

Obviously a bad time to be asking you questions since you have much more important things to be attending tomorrow (for which, I wish you the best of luck). So, certainly no rush.

I wasn't so much pointing out the duels vs. duel difference between the challenge points and monopoly points clauses, but more for both and trying to understand the logic behind granting extra points based on length of duel. It's unclear to me why a 10 round duel win is better than a 5 round duel win, especially if you have something like 5-0 in 5 rounds vs. 5-4 in 10.

Left also to address is the point benefit (if any) of winning the Overlordship via challenge rather than as a tournament prize. As well, how does that play into the Monopoly clause? Would winning the OL in a normal challenge not qualify your team for Monopoly? (since the clause states the titles must be won during the tournaments).

[Candy Hart]

Obviously a bad time to be asking you questions since you have much more important things to be attending tomorrow (for which, I wish you the best of luck). So, certainly no rush.

I wasn't so much pointing out the duels vs. duel difference between the challenge points and monopoly points clauses, but more for both and trying to understand the logic behind granting extra points based on length of duel. It's unclear to me why a 10 round duel win is better than a 5 round duel win, especially if you have something like 5-0 in 5 rounds vs. 5-4 in 10.

Left also to address is the point benefit (if any) of winning the Overlordship via challenge rather than as a tournament prize. As well, how does that play into the Monopoly clause? Would winning the OL in a normal challenge not qualify your team for Monopoly? (since the clause states the titles must be won during the tournaments).

On the ten rounds thing-- I had much the same thought.

On the "titles must be won during the tournaments" ... I believe the actual phrasing was "titles must be won during the tournament" meaning the Hydra Cup tournament.... so titles held prior to the start (like my holding a barony/opal/tower) would not count toward my team having a monopoly.

[Kalamere]

Ahh, yeah that makes sense. Thanks Candy.

~Kal

[Sylus Kurgen]

Alright, I'm home for a bit, had to get some last-minute things...

I wasn't so much pointing out the duels vs. duel difference between the challenge points and monopoly points clauses, but more for both and trying to understand the logic behind granting extra points based on length of duel. It's unclear to me why a 10 round duel win is better than a 5 round duel win, especially if you have something like 5-0 in 5 rounds vs. 5-4 in 10.

The logic behind this isn't so much the importance of 10 rounds vs 5 but more about the points themselves. A big concern was brought up that the points were skewed in favor of the higher ranks. I pulled this back by making all of the tournaments worth the same points. However this left an issue with things like Overlord and Archmage which both have a high ranked tournament associated with the title. Winner of both tournaments gets 50pts+2pts for entering+2points per round advancement.

That point difference is 6 wins any of the other teams would have to make, collectively, in order to catch up. I needed a solution that would hinder those winners from being able to get a +100 point prize for their team. The Points per Round (PpR) was an idea that looked good from a competition point of view.

In most challenges the defender is normally out to end things as soon as possible. This applies to the challenger too. On any challenge either side only gets up to 10 Points Per Round on top of the flat rate. Archmage and Overlord are worth 25pts. Where Baronies, Keeper, and Opal are worth 20 points. Diamond is inadvertently worth 50points because win the DQ and you're Diamond. I needed a way to make regular dueling on par with the tournaments and challenges for the sake of the Hydra competition. X+PpR felt a decent compromise. If it's something that doesn't work out, it won't be back next season, though I might keep it to calculate the Monopoly Bonus.

And challenging for Overlord outside of tournaments follows the same format as that of challenging for Baronies, Keepers, and Opals.

[Sylus Kurgen]

With Hydra completely underway, I'm not going to change any of the rules and let things refer to the rules that are currently posted.

Any precedents that arise through out the next 3 months will be posted in this thread. If any of you see other errors or issues that could use reworking for the next time around, don't be afraid to post as well. I want to built on this and get it right. I'm just one person, and what I have so far has been with the input from many of you. Rome wasn't built in a day and making this a truly recurring event requires work from all of us.

[Candy Hart]

I understand that we have to tell callers that fights are for Hydra for Hydra vs Hydra fights.

Do we also have to do this for a math against someone not in Hydra if we want the 5 points for our team?

Thanks!

[DUEL Sylus]

I understand that we have to tell callers that fights are for Hydra for Hydra vs Hydra fights.

Do we also have to do this for a math against someone not in Hydra if we want the 5 points for our team?

Thanks!

Those participating just have to state Hail Hydra, BEFORE the match begins. (Kidding). Seriously though, if you're in the tournament just let the caller know. Those NOT in the tournament don't have to.

pardon for the DUEL name, was going through shift reports.

[Sylus Kurgen]

Just a note to everyone,

All this week I'm working the midnight shift. I won't be able to update the Hydra points until Friday the 13th. Counting Wyheree's shift last night the Hydra Cup has had a total of 67 duels! That's NOT including the Challenges.

Because of that number, I'm giving Candy access to track the points. She has been running her own point sheet in google.docs and we've been going back and forth to keep each other honest and make sure all of the points are accurate.

Here is my sheet updated as of Saturday after the Old Temple Challene.


Here is Candy's .

If there are any errors in points, you know who to harass and who to jump. On Friday I'm going to go through the reports and check to make sure every declared duel has been calculated.

[Candy Hart]

Contact information is in the profile for all your harassing and jumping on needs. I try to update my sheet daily, but there may be some delays. If something isn't marked "Hydra" by a caller I check the logs to see if it was requested in the room and maybe missed. So don't forget to declare!

[Sylus Kurgen]

Okay folks...we're at the end of Hydra Cups' 2nd week.

As of the end of the 12th, there have been 25 duels fought this week. You guys rock! Keep that stuff coming!

However, now on to some serious business. I said that I'm not going to change any rules. And I'm not. All pros and cons that have arisen by the end of Hydra Cup Season 1, will be evaluated and worked on for Season 2.

A handful of players have brought to me some minor issues with declaring duels to be Hydra or Non-Hydra and how some are just assuming all matches are automatically Hydra.

I recieved this in a PM, I won't use that player's Name because it was in fact a PRIVATE message. I know who this person is, and so will they. However it is a great example to let me discuss why I want to keep the Declaration System.

Have you considered halting the deductions from Hydra? It seems like there is much confusion among duelists/callers about announcing if a duel counts as Hydra. If there were no deductions then the duels wouldn't have to be listed as Hydra since there would be no reason for them not to be Hydra. That would decrease confusion and admin burden.

Also, I've heard a few duelists say that maybe they should avoid a sport so that they don't hurt their team further. That sounded counter-productive to Hydra's goal of increasing participation.

The Declaration System is in place to ALLOW teams to choose which duels are Hydra and which are Not. If Duelist A hits a losing streak, they can opt for their duels to NOT COUNT towards the competition, thus preventing a lot of deductions. Were I to NOT use this system then ALL duels would count and the players and their characters wouldn't have a choice. Why make a tournament that doesn't give the players a choice?


I asked Cor to see if he could have the callers make notations in their reports to help me track points. I have the full list of participants, even without notations I can see who fought who and what points they should be getting. If the caller's don't notate then I have to message Duelists X,Y, and Z asking if this match or that counted for the competition.

I have said it up and down, even in BRIGHT RED LETTERS, No Declaration, No Points.

This Declaration can be in the CHAT ROOM, to the Caller for them to notate their report, or hell ANYONE CAN PM ME THE DUEL RESULTS TO MAKE SURE THEY GET ADDED.

I'm not some enigmatic thing just hunched over a keyboard adding points. If you're unsure on something, message me! I don't bite. Unless you're into that sort of thing. I am available to anyone, at near anytime, that has questions, concerns, and possible improvement ideas.

[Sylus Kurgen]

The third week of Hydra is nearly at a close and up to date (not counting tonight's' Annex duels) there have been over 146 DUELS. I think that's pretty awesome. I hope everyone is enjoying the tournament and the few small surprises I've thrown out since its inception.

There is one small thing I do need to bring up...

Dueling your teammates under an Alternate character for Hydra points.
While I'm aware there isn't anything about it in the rules stating players cannot duel their teammates under an alias, it is a frown point for me. This isn't a breaking of the established rules, but an exploitation of them.

I was messaged by a handful of individuals about a duel in progress where both players were on the same team, but one was under an alias. I spoke with both players A and B to confirm they knew of the other. Player B said it was fine to zero the points but felt more insulted that someone would insinuate the pair were cheating. Which is completely understandable. Cheating is HIGHLY frowned upon by the RoH admin staff and I doubt this was such a case. I assured both that wasn't the case. It was just to keep the points honest. I nullified the points for the duel.

If team members are found to be dueling one another under alternate screen names during regular hours for Hydra, points will be negated. This also applies retroactively to any duels found after the fact.