2015 Rule Q&A

The Second Best Dueling Event of the Year!

Moderators: Sylus Kurgen, Goldglo, Kalamere, Hydra Corporation

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Sylus Kurgen
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Post by Sylus Kurgen » Wed Jul 08, 2015 9:31 pm

Apple wrote:Question about This thread.

Is it the obligation of the Home or Away team to post up the information for the week? Is the information needed to be posted, or at the least can captains E-Mail you with the lineup by 11:59 PM Wednesday so you're in the loop?
The public posting is so that EVERYONE knows when the fights are to take place, for those who want to watch a particular fight and can attend.

Lineup and time-frames need to be CC'd to myself at SylusKurgen@aol.com so that I have confirmation players are communicating with one another. If someone drops the ball in communicating their schedule, I'd like to know about it.
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Post by Kalamere » Sat Jul 11, 2015 9:38 am

Sylus Kurgen wrote:I think that some are making this strategy tool a little more complicated than it needs to be.
Sylus Kurgen wrote: The person who's off that week is back-up sub.
While one sub is officially listed, the 5th member is an auxiliary substitute.
Sylus Kurgen wrote:"Only the sub can Tag-In for another fighter."
In essence the "back up sub" also has the power to Tag-in and leave the listed Sub free to do what they're meant to do within the week.

I will go back and adjust it to SUBS, plural.

The 5th fighter being able to come flying out of left field and tag-in to do a match. Whole new level of strategy to consider.

WWE Monday Night Raw up in here. Guy just comes running down the ramp and leaps into the ring. WHAM with the steel chair

^ Is how I envision the Tag-in system.
You could take this a step further and simply say: Any member of the team may tag into any of their scheduled fights up until the first round of the duel has been announced. Teams are limited to 5 tag-ins / substitutions during the regular season and no individual may participate in more than a single fight per match.

Phrased as such, your scheduled DoM fighter could actually tag in for the scheduled DoF duel, as long as the DoM fight hasn't happened yet. This would necessitate the team to also sub in for that DoM fight of course, but it does open things up a little wider.

It also removes the "for a Wild Card match" language, because from what you're written in this thread, I don't understand the WC status of a duel to actually have any relevance to the clause.
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Post by Sylus Kurgen » Sat Jul 11, 2015 3:48 pm

Kalamere wrote:
Sylus Kurgen wrote:I think that some are making this strategy tool a little more complicated than it needs to be.
Sylus Kurgen wrote: The person who's off that week is back-up sub.
While one sub is officially listed, the 5th member is an auxiliary substitute.
Sylus Kurgen wrote:"Only the sub can Tag-In for another fighter."
In essence the "back up sub" also has the power to Tag-in and leave the listed Sub free to do what they're meant to do within the week.

I will go back and adjust it to SUBS, plural.

The 5th fighter being able to come flying out of left field and tag-in to do a match. Whole new level of strategy to consider.

WWE Monday Night Raw up in here. Guy just comes running down the ramp and leaps into the ring. WHAM with the steel chair

^ Is how I envision the Tag-in system.
You could take this a step further and simply say: Any member of the team may tag into any of their scheduled fights up until the first round of the duel has been announced. Teams are limited to 5 tag-ins / substitutions during the regular season and no individual may participate in more than a single fight per match.

Phrased as such, your scheduled DoM fighter could actually tag in for the scheduled DoF duel, as long as the DoM fight hasn't happened yet. This would necessitate the team to also sub in for that DoM fight of course, but it does open things up a little wider.

It also removes the "for a Wild Card match" language, because from what you're written in this thread, I don't understand the WC status of a duel to actually have any relevance to the clause.
Valid points, Kal. I'm just concerned about broader issues that would give rise to in regards to overall scheduling.

Ex. Red is scheduled to face Salvador in Fists and Matt is scheduled to face Skid in Swords. However Matt tags in for Red....does she then take over his position in the Swords match vs Skid? They just swapped opponents based on their strong suit?

ETA: Thus change the name from Tag-in to Castling, like the chess term where the Rook and King can switch positions so long as they haven't previously moved at all?
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Post by Kalamere » Sat Jul 11, 2015 4:34 pm

Valid points, Kal. I'm just concerned about broader issues that would give rise to in regards to overall scheduling.

Ex. Red is scheduled to face Salvador in Fists and Matt is scheduled to face Skid in Swords. However Matt tags in for Red....does she then take over his position in the Swords match vs Skid? They just swapped opponents based on their strong suit?
Not automatically. Red would be an option, but so would anyone that hadn't dueled for the team yet, though I guess the default would be whoever the listed sub is, followed by the team 5th if the sub had already dueled and replacing them would be another tag-in usage.

In any event, for scheduling purposes, the tag should not alter an already agreed upon and posted agreement. So Skid's arrangements should still be valid, though it's a little up in the air as to who he'll be fighting.
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Post by Apple » Sat Jul 11, 2015 8:02 pm

So tag ins wouldn't be only WC's anymore? Would it be only one match up per week for a team where there can be a tag out? Since there's only 5 weeks of normal league and 5 choices to tag in, is it more viable to choose semi-randomly each week during blind pick then switch duelists around for a better match up before duels start?

If a change does happen, is it going to happen during this season or would any changes be for another?
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Post by Eden Parker » Sun Jul 12, 2015 11:22 pm

The Wildcard
When submitting a line-up, team captains may choose one bout as their team’s Wild Card match. Under the Wildcard heading, teams can apply a point bonus of +1 up to +3 to that one singular match. The fighter who wins, gains those additional points for their team. In the event both Captains choose the same bout as a Wild Card, the winning team gains the combined bonus. A tie negates any Wild Card bonus.
Just as a heads-up, I initially read this language to mean that only the team that designated the match as WC can win the WC bonus. It wasn't until Rachael defeated Andrea in Team Fists' WC match, and earned +3 extra points for Rock Hards, that I realized that "The fighter who wins" means the fighter from either team.

I thought that's why there was a clarification in the next sentence that the winner of a doubly-selected WC gets both sets of points---to distinguish that scenario, and give that scenario extra weight, since you would only have the opportunity to win the opposing team's points by doubly-selecting the WC match.

Pretty sure I preferred my first understanding of the rules.
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Post by Apple » Mon Jul 13, 2015 1:02 am

Eden Parker wrote:Just as a heads-up, I initially read this language to mean that only the team that designated the match as WC can win the WC bonus. It wasn't until Rachael defeated Andrea in Team Fists' WC match, and earned +3 extra points for Rock Hards, that I realized that "The fighter who wins" means the fighter from either team.

I thought that's why there was a clarification in the next sentence that the winner of a doubly-selected WC gets both sets of points---to distinguish that scenario, and give that scenario extra weight, since you would only have the opportunity to win the opposing team's points by doubly-selecting the WC match.

Pretty sure I preferred my first understanding of the rules.
That's how I saw it too. Even more with how it is shown on the website as a (+3) next to the duelists name instead of being between the two of them to show it was possible for the points to go one way or another.
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Post by Sylus Kurgen » Mon Jul 13, 2015 1:26 am

Eden Parker wrote:
The Wildcard
When submitting a line-up, team captains may choose one bout as their team’s Wild Card match. Under the Wildcard heading, teams can apply a point bonus of +1 up to +3 to that one singular match. The fighter who wins, gains those additional points for their team. In the event both Captains choose the same bout as a Wild Card, the winning team gains the combined bonus. A tie negates any Wild Card bonus.
Just as a heads-up, I initially read this language to mean that only the team that designated the match as WC can win the WC bonus. It wasn't until Rachael defeated Andrea in Team Fists' WC match, and earned +3 extra points for Rock Hards, that I realized that "The fighter who wins" means the fighter from either team.

I thought that's why there was a clarification in the next sentence that the winner of a doubly-selected WC gets both sets of points---to distinguish that scenario, and give that scenario extra weight, since you would only have the opportunity to win the opposing team's points by doubly-selecting the WC match.

Pretty sure I preferred my first understanding of the rules.
Bold emphasis is mine.

On the Dashboard, the +3 to one side or the other is to strictly indicate which team chose the match as their Wild Card. (this bit to Apple). The language is a reinforcement. The fighter who wins, gets those points. In pre-season discussions it was gone over that in the situation where both teams pick the same match as their WC, the winning duelist only gets their team's +3. This was revised to apply to both scenarios.
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Post by Kalamere » Mon Jul 13, 2015 8:51 am

I can see how the rule, as written, can be confusing on that front.

Sylus, can we update it for clarity with something like:

The Wildcard
When submitting line-ups, each captain selects one sport and assigns it a value between +1 and +3 as the Wild Card bonus. The fighter who wins this duel will earn for their team the combined value of the Wild Card bonus assigned to it, all the way up to +6 in the event both captains placed a +3 bonus to the same sport. In the case of a tie, however, neither team earns bonus points.
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Post by JewellRavenlock » Mon Jul 13, 2015 10:03 am

Kalamere wrote:I can see how the rule, as written, can be confusing on that front.

Sylus, can we update it for clarity with something like:

The Wildcard
When submitting line-ups, each captain selects one sport and assigns it a value between +1 and +3 as the Wild Card bonus. The fighter who wins this duel will earn for their team the combined value of the Wild Card bonus assigned to it, all the way up to +6 in the event both captains placed a +3 bonus to the same sport. In the case of a tie, however, neither team earns bonus points.
This wording is much clearer. I read it much the same way Eden did.
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Post by Sylus Kurgen » Mon Jul 13, 2015 11:29 am

Kalamere wrote:I can see how the rule, as written, can be confusing on that front.

Sylus, can we update it for clarity with something like:

The Wildcard
When submitting line-ups, each captain selects one sport and assigns it a value between +1 and +3 as the Wild Card bonus. The fighter who wins this duel will earn for their team the combined value of the Wild Card bonus assigned to it, all the way up to +6 in the event both captains placed a +3 bonus to the same sport. In the case of a tie, however, neither team earns bonus points.
Make it so, #1. I knew that if Eden and Apple were stating they didn't fully understand it, then there would be others. Was planning to work on that today. It's a simple enough change.
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Post by Apple » Mon Jul 13, 2015 1:23 pm

Thx for the fix and explanations.
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Post by Kalamere » Mon Jul 13, 2015 1:52 pm

I updated the rules page of the Dashboard to reflect the clarified language. Please also update the posted Season 3 rules here (http://www.ringsofhonor.org/forums/view ... hp?t=29279) so we stay in sync.

~Kal
Last edited by Kalamere on Mon Jul 13, 2015 3:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Eden Parker » Mon Jul 13, 2015 3:02 pm

Thanks for adjusting the language! :)
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Post by Sylus Kurgen » Mon Jul 13, 2015 9:15 pm

Kalamere wrote:I updated the rules page of the Dashboard to reflect the clarified language. Please also update the posted Season 3 rules here (http://www.ringsofhonor.org/forums/view ... hp?t=29279) so we stay in sync.

~Kal
Forum-side rules updated to reflect the change.
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