Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

A place for the players and staff to communicate, share ideas, report bugs, make suggestions, and build our community.

Moderator: Staff

User avatar
Peaches
Adventurer
Adventurer
Posts: 75
Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2013 10:27 pm
Location: Running with concrete wolves & flirting beneath neon lights.
Contact:

Re: Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

Post by Peaches » Sun Feb 02, 2020 3:45 pm

Just wanted to throw out an opinion about what Jake was questioning. And I think others are also suggesting something on the same page.

The other servers that I'm apart of do have a channel dedicated to OOC conversations about live play that is happening. I like it because given how the lobby can be poppin' with conversations, it gives people the ability to comment and talk about the live play happening with out it getting lost in the shuffle, especially since a busy IC room could also be taking up a lot of peoples creative attention. It also mitigates the multitasking of having to switch between DM's with other players that are also writing in the room.

So I guess the Green Room suggestion is what I'm agreeing with.
User avatar
KhaoticBliss
Adventurer
Adventurer
Posts: 61
Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:33 am
Location: At an opportune moment
Contact:

Re: Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

Post by KhaoticBliss » Thu Feb 06, 2020 4:45 pm

Hi. I'm one of those players who literally never participates in the lobby anymore. I read the player and server announcements for events I want Saila to participate in, but I have the lobby muted entirely.

To build on what Cane said, I just...found myself with nothing to say. The long, involved conversations about things I had nothing to do with, the same four topics that came up over and over... it's not that I was "turned off" or that any one thing made me quit reading it, but I muted it and then I got out of the habit of checking on it and now I'm fully disengaged: I don't look at it at all anymore.

Probably, that lack of engagement has something to do with why I rarely if ever play anymore, too. Let me stress here again that it's nobody's fault but my own. I am, however, super grateful to the handful of you who still ping me directly and/or include me in your pocket servers, because that's my connection to this world these days and I still love this world. And all of you.

So... how to fix it? I dunno. I do like the idea of a live-play-ooc room as a separate thing. Sometimes there are logistics to sort out/clarify in a big scene. Ex: "Hey, is your character looking at mine?" "Is he still sitting on that stool or did he move?" or "hey guys nobody kill the clockwork bird I have a plan for that in three.. two..." That's the kind of thing that can get completely lost in a wider lobby. It's also a fun place to motivate each other, à la "omg I can't believe she just said that! wait till you see how he's about to respond." or "Holy wow that was a great post" or whatever. I can't think of anything beyond that because like.. I don't really know that community spirit is something that can be fostered with "rules", you know? I will think on it some more.
Cianan
Junior Adventurer
Junior Adventurer
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2014 7:18 pm
Location: Wherever.

Re: Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

Post by Cianan » Fri Feb 07, 2020 1:32 am

I think having the lobby be open, and mostly rules light is fine.

I get grumpy about stuff too, but it should be a warm place where people see that we're at least someone active, and can encourage people to participate.

An IC greenroom is a neat idea, too!

Maybe a dedicated silly picture/gif channel for when it gets heavy? Just to direct people who are being over active with it (myself) to go to. It could double as an inspiration channel, throwing in neat RP/Character pictures/Characters You Wanna Play Pictures.
User avatar
Sulissurn
Junior Adventurer
Junior Adventurer
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:42 pm
Location: A shadow.
Contact:

Re: Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

Post by Sulissurn » Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:41 pm

Am I at "work," at home right now?

You bet.

Am I that, "weird pink haired chick with the creepy drow that just lurks all the time who the hell is she?" Also yes. Here's my filthy two pennies.
  • No rules will frighten away those who want rules.
  • Light rules will frighten away those who want no rules.
  • Specific, clearly laid out rules will distance those who want no rules/light rules and harm those who wish to express very important issues, such as discrimination, predatory, gas-lighting, ignorance and other behaviors that have distanced many and will no doubt make players feel like their voice is not wanted
So what's the happy medium?

With this many people on the server and in the Lobby? I don't think there'll ever be a perfect half way point between for all. I think you are all doing everything you can already to balance user and staff needs as best as possible at this moment.

You guys are always taking into consideration what the community is telling you. Maybe toss up a poll or survey that allows them to completely anonymously answer the questions you may have about the lobby? But I feel like you'll do what you think is right, as I actually, y'know, trust you guys. Because you're open about the things you do. It is as much YOUR (staff) community as ours. As long as you keep (and you do) being open and communicating openly like this, I think it's gonna be fine.

In short. I had a point, but I don't know if any of it came across. Too much of anything is exhausting, even if it's good. Especially if its bad. How do you corral so many different people though? No idea.

Thanks for coming to my Nobody Needed This Ted Talk.
User avatar
PrlUnicorn
Expert Adventurer
Expert Adventurer
Posts: 833
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2006 4:48 pm
Location: Navarra

Re: Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

Post by PrlUnicorn » Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:09 am

The Lobby as well as the RP chats are public areas and as such, they belong to everyone. With that in mind, if someone brings up a topic in the Lobby, they should be prepared for discussion and disagreement. If that's not the case, the subject is probably best left out of that public area. This is especially true if those objecting to dissension are the same people that think it's perfectly fine to stomp all over the opinions of others. That's a rather unfair expectation on their behalf and behaving in a manner that is effectively breaking what's been called the Don't be a dick rule. If you're telling people to shut up (in any way, shape, or form) while telling them they must listen to your opinions, it's hypocritical.

One of the unfortunate consequences of this and similar behaviors is that the people in question are often ignorant of how they have come across to others and can't understand why people are reacting to them in a negative manner. In my experience, there is no point in trying to explain to someone until they are ready to listen. In the meantime, they are likely to be ignored.

Muting individuals has been suggested, but to my knowledge muting an individual is a universal setting not just a particular channel. The other problem with muting an individual is that silence is often interpreted as agreement with someone's idea/behavior. The reality, however, is that many who are silent are just fed up and/or no longer participating in the Lobby.
Reiko Souma
Adventurer
Adventurer
Posts: 40
Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 8:38 pm
Location: Camden, NJ, Terra; visits Rhy'din on vacations
Contact:

Re: Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

Post by Reiko Souma » Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:39 pm

Hello,

I first want to express my appreciation for this forum being opened up for feedback. Not many sites will offer this opportunity to its members, so for that I'm grateful. There's a lot of feedback I have in terms of agreeing, disagreeing, and suggestions of my own to be made...I'll try not to make this too lengthy.

Much of my feedback comes from agreement with BardGallant, PrlUnicorn, and Alasdair Galloway.

Agree
- Excessive complaining and negativity: Everybody has their bad days. I get it; I understand. We're all human...Hell, I've had mine recently, myself. I agree with PrlUnicorn, in favour of concerns for bringing others down, there possibly be a "vent channel" in the OOC section. Not everybody is able to vent their stresses to anyone outside of this server; some people no doubt trust others on the server more than they trust others off the server. We simply don't know their full situation is why I agree with this suggestion. I'm currently on alternate servers where this is an option, and I've noticed that it seems to work. Maybe it can be tried out here, even if only temporarily, to see whether it's something that will work out in the long run or not.
- Excessive sexual advances and lewd commentary: Again, we're all human. Out of respect for those of varying cultures and backgrounds, there's a time and place for everything. I don't think the public space - that is, the lobby and varying role-play rooms - is the place for it. Minours do occasionally come around. Please, oh please, can things like this stay in the DMs?
- "IC personas extending into the OOC channel:" I couldn't not directly quote this one because I feel really iffy about some of what I see in terms of this taking place in the lobby. The iffy feeling is because, as silly as it can be with innocent fun at times, I find it also blurs the line that separates reality from role-play...seeing some of this take place in the lobby makes me feel weird. I don't know of any other word for it.
- The don't be a dick rule: To borrow some of PrlUnicorn's words here, "Some people are dicks and need to be told it." I agree (and yes, I know I can be one at times and apologise for it, but that's not for here), and I really think a lot more people who are dicks should really have this made aware to them in kind words, and that how they treat others - whether a few or a lot of others - is unacceptable. This doesn't include the occasional disagreements that take place, either.
- A suggestion is that personal information shouldn't be allowed...: I agree with Alasdair on this because there's zero expectation of privacy on the Internet, no matter how anonymous we may think it is. People share their selfies and information with the full risk that 500+ people are going to see it, even if close to 100-120 people are online (this includes those who use the invisible icon). Although I see this as a common sense matter, and nearly all of us who are adults, it's not a good idea. This is actually why I prefer to be addressed by my in-character name and try to limit my personal share to my pronouns of they/them and he/him. Or photos I take when I'm out in public that don't reveal specifically what city or town I live in.
- In-Character Planning: As guilty as I am of doing this in the lobby, and possibly in excess, I find that a separate channel to plan role-play ideas and share might be helpful. My first thought is in terms of organisation, my second thought being in terms of possibly less clutter in the lobby. My personal perspective is that the lobby is a place to relax outside of role-play and have a good time with people. I don't always want to see shop talk and will click away from the lobby to DM someone sometimes out of courtesy. DM'ing can get tedious for role-play ideas when individual and group DMs can get lost amongst other DMs, complicated when different storylines involve some of the same players but not all, etc.
- "Always-on Lobby," as Bailey Raptis worded it. Would it be possible to have the options of ?lobby on and ?lobby off, or something viable, like we have ?rp on and ?rp off? I liked it when the flash chat on RDI had that - not going to lie. Maybe there's another feature on Discord that I'm not utilising that I should be, apart from muting notifications? I have every room muted to keep my poor phone from going ballistic.
- FAQ channel: I also agree with Bailey Raptis on this. When new people join the server, maybe it can be the first thing they see. Then, if they have any questions after reading the read-only FAQ channel, they can ask the lobby or ping a staff member, whichever is deemed more appropriate for that individual.
- Channel for memes/gif/cat tax: The cat tax is my expansion on what I agree with Cianan on, but not only because things tend to start getting heavy. It's also because the picture sharing in the lobby can get a bit much a times. Then again, it could also be my literal OCD for things being organised.

Disagree
- "Let people complain." I'm sorry, Alasdair, but I disagree with this for the reason of: if multiple people were to complain in the lobby, and someone new was to join, then how good are the chances that they might actually stick around? What kind of an impression would this give them? I don't see it as giving a good impression for new people.
- "I feel rules on the lobby, besides the most base rules of human interaction, is something that at its foundation goes against the spirit of the idea of writing as a whole." I have a very strong disagreement to this because...yes, there are the options of muting a room and putting someone on ignore if they get to be way too much for someone to want to deal with for one reason or another, but the, "don't be a dick" and basic server guidelines are nowhere near close to enough when it comes to maintaining a positive environment. After observing for some time, I would like to believe a possible reason for that is a lack of a FAQ channel that could always include a link to the community guidelines for easy access. The staff is only human and can't be around 24/7 to copy and paste a link to the community guidelines or FAQs for every new member either.

Additional
- Gang-Up Mentality: This happens too often. Somebody will say something, and suddenly a bunch of people will jump all over that one person. This is very unnecessary, and I have seen both staff and non-staff do this to myself and other people. If a staff member says something to someone, such as a response to a member's questionable comment, then there really is no need for anybody else to jump on that same person. One person saying something once is enough. It can become rather overwhelming and stir up possibly undesired feelings. (This doesn't include the welcome of new members, positive things like congratulating someone or wishing them the best with something, or responses to questions for advice, etc.)
- Line spam of text: I'm reluctant to even address this because everybody has their different styles of chatting in chat settings; however, I do want to address this because I've seen some people's messages get lost amidst messages that may resemble something like the below from a small number of people (whether at the same time or not):
Typing my messages because I have
A lot
To say,
But I'm
So
Excited
I can hardly contain myself
So I feel the need to
Type
Like
This
The above example might be a little bit of an extreme example, but it does happen, and I'm wondering if this could be addressed somehow. Whether it means a brief slowdown feature of one or two seconds that Discord has being temporarily enabled somehow, or whatever the staff and admin come up with...
- Expansion on rules/guidelines: Because this has happened before and I don't see it on the website anywhere, I would like to suggest the following addition to the Community Guidelines - A disclaimer that the staff (and members, if necessary) are not professionally trained to handle various crises, and that anyone who might be experience a trauma of some sort be directed to contact their local emergency hotline or authorities. And, if necessary, add a toll-free hotline for the USA and UK.
- Ask the Staff/Featured Staff: This is merely a suggestion to boost interaction, whether someone is very active in the lobby or not. "Ask the Staff (and admins!)," a panel where members are invited to ask various questions about the site, the features, or even role-plays themselves. Questions that aren't already in the FAQs would be highly encouraged, such as, "What is the weirdest thing that the staff has ever dealt with?," "Why are there so many NPCs like the gnome sisters in the Perch?," or even silly ones like, "Do your character/s prefer juggling swords or torches?"
As for "Featured Staff," members could be invited to vote on a staff member to be featured on the site once a month, where the featured staff member would be interviewed by other staff members. If the staff member is voted in more than once, then different questions could be asked to keep things interesting.
Granted these two suggestions aren't strictly lobby-related, but there are close to 4,000 members on the site itself and less than 25% of them are on Discord. Done right, there could be a boost in the number of people who come over to Discord and take part in the live-play.

I apologise if there's a lot here...I typed all of this on my phone.
"A bon jour bone euvre."
[For a good day, a good deed.]
- French proverb, 1307

Don't see me online? Find me on Discord or on Facebook.
User avatar
Yeardley Owens
Adventurer
Adventurer
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2012 9:24 pm
Location: Still here

Re: Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

Post by Yeardley Owens » Tue Feb 11, 2020 1:06 pm

I tend to avoid these, because it's never going to happen that everyone agrees, but I felt the need to pipe up here.

Big part of the reason I gave up on DM was because of the rules. We are, for the most part, adults, and should be able to control ourselves just like we would offline.

If you wouldn't say it to someone's face, don't say it here - ie; don't be a dick.

If someone says something that bothers you address it with them in DMs, most people are reasonable.

Maybe some people don't like swear, maybe some people don't like landscapers, maybe some don't like demi-gods, maybe some people don't like OOC RP in the lobby. If you start worrying about people being offended about some things it's a slippery slope until there are more and more things, and you end up with a server like many others that have a long list of rules and guidelines to agree to before joining. From my days starting on AOL, for a few free hours a month, that's never been what this RP community is about, and I hope it stays that way.

Be a considerate adult and don't be a dick. I'm with Alasdair.
User avatar
Canaan
Adventurer
Adventurer
Posts: 94
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2014 2:14 pm

Re: Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

Post by Canaan » Thu Feb 13, 2020 5:19 pm

I felt the need to make a follow-up here so that I can be perfectly clear. Apparently my frustrated tongue-in-cheek request that no whining be made a rule was taken as sincerity. I thought it went without saying, but obviously not -- "No Whining" and "No Negativity" cannot possibly be made a rule. Nor would I actually want it to be. Who the hell would enforce it? (Going a step further, who would enforce any of the things suggested here? We just got away from a psycho dictator regime. We don't need another one.) Do I still think less negativity and more positivity makes this place welcoming? Will that approach catch and keep more users? Absolutely - 100%. But making a list of unnecessary rules is just as much a turn off as constant bitching.

I agree with Yeardley in that "we are, for the most part, adults, and should be able to control ourselves just like we would offline." Should being the operative word there. Don't be a dick should be a simple rule to follow, and for most of us, it is.

Mallory wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 12:17 pm
This is your lobby and you should have a say in what it looks like and how we can get it/keep it there. With that in mind: What behaviors make the lobby a welcoming, respectful, and inclusive environment? What are some “best practices” when engaging in the lobby? And what are some behaviors that we should all be more cognizant of because they may make it a less welcoming or inclusive place?
This was never a conversation about rule-making. Or, at least, it wasn't supposed to be. People have brought up behaviors that make the place better, and they've pointed out things that make it not so great. I think that, for the most part, this has been a good conversation. I'd even say it's done its job of making people more cognizant of what they put out there. I've noticed a change in tone in the lobby -- and it's nice.

TL;DR - I don't want any more rules or more rooms beyond a "green room". Like, honestly, that's been the absolute best suggestion in this whole thread. Please, pretty please, give us that option.
User avatar
Koyan
Adventurer
Adventurer
Posts: 16
Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2019 2:42 pm
Location: Alvaka

Re: Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

Post by Koyan » Sat Feb 15, 2020 11:08 am

I think there needs to be a separate channel for gifs/pictures/memes etc. It's out of control and seems to be getting worse. It's annoying to be forced to scroll back through Meme War 2020 just to find a bit of text.

My two cents.
Reiko Souma
Adventurer
Adventurer
Posts: 40
Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 8:38 pm
Location: Camden, NJ, Terra; visits Rhy'din on vacations
Contact:

Re: Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

Post by Reiko Souma » Sat Feb 15, 2020 12:08 pm

Koyan wrote:
Sat Feb 15, 2020 11:08 am
I think there needs to be a separate channel for gifs/pictures/memes etc. It's out of control and seems to be getting worse. It's annoying to be forced to scroll back through Meme War 2020 just to find a bit of text.

My two cents.
Yes, please! A few of the same people seem to be doing this in excess...if not a separate channel for this, because of some who have expressed not wanting to see an excessive number of channels added, then some kind of measure (not a rule) to encourage the sharers to slow it down or maybe take it to the DMs?
"A bon jour bone euvre."
[For a good day, a good deed.]
- French proverb, 1307

Don't see me online? Find me on Discord or on Facebook.
User avatar
Rachael Blackthorne
Seasoned Adventurer
Seasoned Adventurer
Posts: 319
Joined: Mon Aug 03, 2009 6:26 am
Location: A beach house in Arcadia

Re: Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

Post by Rachael Blackthorne » Sun Feb 16, 2020 5:24 am

I have been reading this thread, and one statement comes to mind for me with regards to lobby behavior and how it should be handled in my humble opinion.

Just because one can do something, it does not mean that one should.

This applies to the (over)use of GIFs as well as other potentially offensive/offputting to some behaviors that were mentioned in the thread.

For the record, I keep all of the non-dueling rooms, including the lobby, on mute. I also mute the server globally. I only de-mute the server/applicable non-dueling room when I am actually playing. This is to avoid being driven bonkers by seeing the red dot on my Discord desktop client constantly flashing when I'm not actually playing.

The opinions expressed here are my own. Your mileage may vary.
The hand is quicker than the eye.
User avatar
Josette Wheeler
Adventurer
Adventurer
Posts: 48
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 6:25 pm

Re: Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

Post by Josette Wheeler » Sun Feb 16, 2020 10:47 am

I’d absolutely love to see a Green Room type channel that is dedicated solely to what is going on in the live play rooms! I tend to easily miss things when the room is really flying, especially for the big events, so that would be very helpful for someone like me.

It takes me a lot of time to scroll back through not just the room I’m writing in, but the lobby as well to see if I missed any comments about what is happening in the room.

That way, the people that are chatting and catching up with each other in the lobby can feel free to do their thing, and the people that just want to focus on play and what is going on in the rooms can do so without having to endlessly scroll up through the lobby. I see that as a best of both worlds option for everyone.

I’d also just love a place to give a shout out to the amazing writing happening, even when I’m not currently active in the rooms!

I also agree that excessive rules tend to drive people away the same way excessive negativity does. Not everyone’s personalites, humor style etc are always going to vibe, but I think for the most part, our community is pretty respectful and awesome as a whole!
User avatar
Mesteno
Proven Adventurer
Proven Adventurer
Posts: 296
Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2018 5:55 pm
Location: Rhy'Din
Contact:

Re: Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

Post by Mesteno » Sun Feb 16, 2020 1:04 pm

Some people have suggested a room for venting. I get the reasoning, but if I were joining a new server and saw they’d had to make a channel specifically for that, I’d be concerned about just how much negativity there was to warrant such a thing.

Green room idea is good. Please make it happen.

Potentially unpopular opinion 1. OOC action narration. Maybe I’m just old and grumpy but again, for first impressions, if I were entering a lobby and witnessing people narrating snuggle piles I’d be concerned about the age of the players I was joining.

Potentially unpopular opinion 2. ‘Funny’ animal gifs that aren’t actually funny at all. I don’t want to see cats falling down stairs because of people setting them up for internet points.
Image
User avatar
Sulissurn
Junior Adventurer
Junior Adventurer
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:42 pm
Location: A shadow.
Contact:

Re: Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

Post by Sulissurn » Tue Feb 18, 2020 12:47 pm

Sorry about using the rules word if it threw anyone off, also I should have chosen guidelines or something but yeah.

I like a green room idea for all the gifs and cat pics and stuff. That way when I show up once a month I can show everyone my babies.

Image
User avatar
Jake
Top Thug
Top Thug
Posts: 2129
Joined: Wed Feb 11, 2004 1:25 am
Location: Red Orc Brewery, a dueling venue, or the taverns of Badside
Contact:

Re: Lobby Behaviors and Best Practices Discussion

Post by Jake » Tue Feb 18, 2020 2:26 pm

Sulissurn wrote:
Tue Feb 18, 2020 12:47 pm
I like a green room idea for all the gifs and cat pics and stuff. That way when I show up once a month I can show everyone my babies.
The Green Room idea is to support whatever current RP is happening with a means to provide OOC organizing and coordination. It would not be for memes, cat gifs, and stuff.
Post Reply

Return to “Community Townhall”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest